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Altice Terug naar discussie overzicht

Altice, december 2017, bodem bereikt ?

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  1. Onderbouwer 4 december 2017 17:57
    Zoals ik al eerder zei. Binnen paar dagen is alles weer hosanna en was alles een storm in een glas water. Deze aandacht was op termijn goed voor Altice. Iedereen weer wakker geschud en betere focus.

    Koersdoel 2020 €50
  2. forum rang 4 BW2017 4 december 2017 17:58
    Dicalli69 op het Gemalto forum :

    Is die hier klaar met liegen , begint die daar.

    Quote
    Ik zat sinds de derde winstwaarschuwing short, heb mijn positie gedraaid, dus ik mag bijna € 19,- per aandeel verlies oplopen, maar ik verkoop op de dag van de resultaten boven de € 36,- !!!
  3. forum rang 4 Toekomstbeeld 4 december 2017 17:59
    Goldman Sachs tried to cut its debt exposure to Altice

    US bank approached several funds in attempt to sell part of a loan made to French group

    Robert Smith in London and Harriet Agnew in Paris
    5 HOURS AGO 0
    Goldman Sachs has tried to cut its debt exposure to Altice, the French telecoms and cable group whose share price has more than halved in the past month, in the latest sign of nervousness about the company’s €51bn debt pile.

    Goldman Sachs has been one of the biggest lenders to Altice and its founder, Patrick Drahi, over the past five years, providing the Franco-Israeli billionaire’s private investment vehicles with margin loans and other debt facilities in the run-up to the group’s initial public offering in 2014. The US bank has also been one of the main beneficiaries of investment banking fees paid out by Altice in the past few years as it embarked on an acquisition spree in France, Portugal and the US.

    As concerns grew about the company’s performance in November, Goldman Sachs approached several funds in an attempt to sell part of a loan it had previously made to Altice, according to persons familiar with the matter. The US bank’s attempt to sell on this debt suggests that the price collapse of the heavily indebted company’s public shares and bonds is starting to rattle some of its core lenders.

    Goldman Sachs and Altice declined to comment on the matter.

    “The banks with very large exposures are nervous,” said one senior debt banker.

    For a lot of people it was a big warning sign. Goldman clearly blinked on it, as they can be a bit more pre-emptive in how they handle their credit risk

    A credit fund manager
    Goldman Sachs is one of the main lenders to Altice’s “topco” — the entity at which its Netherlands-listed shares sit and which has more than €2.3bn of debt. In contrast to most of Altice’s €51bn debt, this has never been publicly syndicated to institutional investors and sits on the balance sheets of what the company calls its “relationship banks”.

    One credit fund manager said that Goldman Sachs “tried to syndicate their topco debt” in November, which he said had made funds that the bank approached over a potential debt sale more concerned about the group’s finances.

    “I think for a lot of people it was a big warning sign,” he said. “Goldman clearly blinked on it, as they can be a bit more pre-emptive [than other banks] in how they handle their credit risk.”

    Altice increased this topco loan facility by €950m in August, meaning its banks took on additional exposure just a few months before the company’s shares and bonds came under significant pressure.

    Altice has pledged to cut its debt by selling non-core assets and turning round operations in its largest market of France. The group has repeatedly tried to assert that it is financially stable despite the decline in its share price, pointing out that it has no significant debt maturities coming up for renewal until 2022.

    The banker added that Altice’s larger lenders have also provided private financing to Mr Drahi himself, adding to their overall exposure to the group.

    “That’s the other side of the coin, which is not public: just how leveraged Drahi is personally,” he said.


    The company publicly announced in November that Next Alt — Mr Drahi’s main investment vehicle — does not have “any margin loan exposure to Altice”, in an attempt to reassure investors about the impact of the founder’s private debt.

    But Goldman Sachs two years ago provided Next Alt with a “funded collar” facility — a complicated derivatives options trade on Altice shares — that was used to repay margin loans and other debt that the US bank had earlier lent to Mr Drahi’s investment vehicle.

    This collar facility is still outstanding, meaning that Goldman Sachs is exposed to a fall in the share price, which has fuelled concerns that it could force the bank to sell Altice shares. Altice said that this speculation is “unfounded”, however, as under the facility the US bank has in fact been a “natural buyer as the shares have traded lower”.

    Altice Luxembourg’s bonds on Monday fell to their lowest prices since July 2016, with its euro bond maturing in 2025 falling to as low as 91.5 cents on the euro. Bond yields rise as prices fall and this €750m bond is now yielding nearly 8 per cent.

    www.ft.com/content/c13313b2-d5f9-11e7...
  4. Onderbouwer 4 december 2017 18:02
    quote:

    moneymaker_BX schreef op 4 december 2017 18:00:

    In USA al weer fors lager
    morgen evenhard down
    allemaal lucht list en bedrog die stijging
    Lariekoek.

    ATUS om 17.35 $18.19
    Nu $18.23
  5. forum rang 4 BW2017 4 december 2017 18:03
    quote:

    moneymaker_BX schreef op 4 december 2017 18:00:

    In USA al weer fors lager
    morgen evenhard down
    allemaal lucht list en bedrog die stijging
    Aan je berichten de laatste uren te zien , zit jij in iedergeval niet Long.

    Wil je er even op wijzen voor het geval je het niet wist, het helpt niet om de koers omlaag te praten op fora.
  6. tralalala 4 december 2017 18:18
    quote:

    BW2017 schreef op 4 december 2017 18:03:

    [...]

    Aan je berichten de laatste uren te zien , zit jij in iedergeval niet Long.

    Wil je er even op wijzen voor het geval je het niet wist, het helpt niet om de koers omlaag te praten op fora.
    Goed gezien jochie ;-)
  7. Onderbouwer 4 december 2017 18:32
    quote:

    Toekomstbeeld schreef op 4 december 2017 18:12:

    Toch weer uitgebreid door AQR. Melding 1 december.

    AQR Capital Management, LLC Altice N.V. NL0011333752

    2,06% (was 1,9%)
    01 dec 2017

    www.afm.nl/nl-nl/professionals/regist...

    Heerlijk nog ruim 30miljoen stuks koopkracht tegoed.
  8. pieren 4 december 2017 18:47
    quote:

    Onderbouwer schreef op 4 december 2017 18:32:

    [...]

    Heerlijk nog ruim 30miljoen stuks koopkracht tegoed.
    Dat vind ik nou een mooie reactie en zo is het maar net.

    Hoe meer partijen short gaan, hoe groter de terugkoopdruk op het moment van draaien.

    Uiteindelijk zullen ze weer een keertje moeten coveren.
  9. forum rang 4 Bernardo 4 december 2017 18:47
    quote:

    Toekomstbeeld schreef op 4 december 2017 18:12:

    Toch weer uitgebreid door AQR. Melding 1 december.

    AQR Capital Management, LLC Altice N.V. NL0011333752

    2,06% (was 1,9%)
    01 dec 2017

    www.afm.nl/nl-nl/professionals/regist...

    porsche had ook eens een grote shorter. De beste man was miljonair. Heeft uiteindelijk zelfmoord gepleegt. Ging failiet aan het shorten toen porsche maar bleef stijgen.
  10. forum rang 6 gpjf 4 december 2017 18:52
    quote:

    Onderbouwer schreef op 4 december 2017 18:32:

    [...]

    Heerlijk nog ruim 30miljoen stuks koopkracht tegoed.
    daar houd ik van, met een positieve blik naar de mogelijkheden kijken.
  11. forum rang 5 Drs P. 4 december 2017 19:16
    quote:

    Toekomstbeeld schreef op 4 december 2017 17:59:

    Goldman Sachs tried to cut its debt exposure to Altice

    US bank approached several funds in attempt to sell part of a loan made to French group

    Robert Smith in London and Harriet Agnew in Paris
    5 HOURS AGO 0
    Goldman Sachs has tried to cut its debt exposure to Altice, the French telecoms and cable group whose share price has more than halved in the past month, in the latest sign of nervousness about the company’s €51bn debt pile.

    Goldman Sachs has been one of the biggest lenders to Altice and its founder, Patrick Drahi, over the past five years, providing the Franco-Israeli billionaire’s private investment vehicles with margin loans and other debt facilities in the run-up to the group’s initial public offering in 2014. The US bank has also been one of the main beneficiaries of investment banking fees paid out by Altice in the past few years as it embarked on an acquisition spree in France, Portugal and the ....

    This collar facility is still outstanding, meaning that Goldman Sachs is exposed to a fall in the share price, which has fuelled concerns that it could force the bank to sell Altice shares. Altice said that this speculation is “unfounded”, however, as under the facility the US bank has in fact been a “natural buyer as the shares have traded lower”.

    Altice Luxembourg’s bonds on Monday fell to their lowest prices since July 2016, with its euro bond maturing in 2025 falling to as low as 91.5 cents on the euro. Bond yields rise as prices fall and this €750m bond is now yielding nearly 8 per cent.

    www.ft.com/content/c13313b2-d5f9-11e7...

    Hmm dit is het FT artcle: jouw stukje over bond yields is niet origineel..

    Goldman Sachs tried to cut its debt exposure to Altice
    US bank approached several funds in attempt to sell part of a loan made to French group

    December 4, 2017 11:29 am by Robert Smith in London and Harriet Agnew in Paris
    Goldman Sachs has tried to cut its debt exposure to Altice, the French telecoms and cable group whose share price has more than halved in the past month, in the latest sign of nervousness about the company’s €51bn debt pile.

    Goldman Sachs has been one of the biggest lenders to Altice and its founder, Patrick Drahi, over the past five years, providing the Franco-Israeli billionaire’s private investment vehicles with margin loans and other debt facilities in the run-up to the group’s initial public offering in 2014. The US bank has also been one of the main beneficiaries of investment banking fees paid out by Altice in the past few years as it embarked on an acquisition spree in France, Portugal and the US.

    As concerns grew about the company’s performance in November, Goldman Sachs approached several funds in an attempt to sell part of a loan it had previously made to Altice, according to persons familiar with the matter. The US bank’s attempt to sell on this debt suggests that the price collapse of the heavily indebted company’s public shares and bonds is starting to rattle some of its core lenders.

    Goldman Sachs and Altice declined to comment on the matter.

    “The banks with very large exposures are nervous,” said one senior debt banker.

    Goldman Sachs is one of the main lenders to Altice’s “topco” — the entity at which its Netherlands-listed shares sit and which has more than €2.3bn of debt. In contrast to most of Altice’s €51bn debt, this has never been publicly syndicated to institutional investors and sits on the balance sheets of what the company calls its “relationship banks”.

    One credit fund manager said that Goldman Sachs “tried to syndicate their topco debt” in November, which he said had made funds that the bank approached over a potential debt sale more concerned about the group’s finances.

    “I think for a lot of people it was a big warning sign,” he said. “Goldman clearly blinked on it, as they can be a bit more pre-emptive [than other banks] in how they handle their credit risk.”

    Altice increased this topco loan facility by €950m in August, meaning its banks took on additional exposure just a few months before the company’s shares and bonds came under significant pressure.

    Altice has pledged to cut its debt by selling non-core assets and turning round operations in its largest market of France. The group has repeatedly tried to assert that it is financially stable despite the decline in its share price, pointing out that it has no significant debt maturities coming up for renewal until 2022.

    The banker added that Altice’s larger lenders have also provided private financing to Mr Drahi himself, adding to their overall exposure to the group.

    “That’s the other side of the coin, which is not public: just how leveraged Drahi is personally,” he said.

    The company publicly announced in November that Next Alt — Mr Drahi’s main investment vehicle — does not have “any margin loan exposure to Altice”, in an attempt to reassure investors about the impact of the founder’s private debt.

    But Goldman Sachs two years ago provided Next Alt with a “funded collar” facility — a complicated derivatives options trade on Altice shares — that was used to repay margin loans and other debt that the US bank had earlier lent to Mr Drahi’s investment vehicle.

    This collar facility is still outstanding, meaning that Goldman Sachs is exposed to a fall in the share price, which has fuelled concerns that it could force the bank to sell Altice shares. Altice said that this speculation is “unfounded”, however, as under the facility the US bank has in fact been a “natural buyer as the shares have traded lower”.

    Copyright The Financial Times Limited . All rights reserved. Please don't copy articles from FT.com and redistribute by email or post to the web.

    View comments
  12. Onderbouwer 4 december 2017 19:22
    Als John de Mol nou slim is koopt hij morgen in een ochtend alles tot €10 op en zorgen dat het er niet meer onder komt. Even AQR in zijn sop gaar laten koken. Als ik miljardair was zou ik zulke geintjes uithalen. Dan komen ze vanzelf vragen of jij een stuk van je long positie wil ruilen.

    Maarja geen miljardair. (Nog).

    Als Altice in 2020 de €50 aantikt heb ik de eerste stap gezet
  13. [verwijderd] 4 december 2017 19:24
    quote:

    Onderbouwer schreef op 4 december 2017 19:22:

    Als John de Mol nou slim is koopt hij morgen in een ochtend alles tot €10 op en zorgen dat het er niet meer onder komt. Even AQR in zijn sop gaar laten koken. Als ik miljardair was zou ik zulke geintjes uithalen. Dan komen ze vanzelf vragen of jij een stuk van je long positie wil ruilen.

    Maarja geen miljardair. (Nog).

    Als Altice in 2020 de €50 aantikt heb ik de eerste stap gezet
    Zal je nooit worden ook, morgen weer -4%.
  14. [verwijderd] 4 december 2017 19:27
    quote:

    Onderbouwer schreef op 4 december 2017 19:22:

    Als John de Mol nou slim is koopt hij morgen in een ochtend alles tot €10 op en zorgen dat het er niet meer onder komt. Even AQR in zijn sop gaar laten koken. Als ik miljardair was zou ik zulke geintjes uithalen. Dan komen ze vanzelf vragen of jij een stuk van je long positie wil ruilen.

    Maarja geen miljardair. (Nog).

    Als Altice in 2020 de €50 aantikt heb ik de eerste stap gezet
    Juj bezit 20 miljoen aandelen Altice?
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